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Has Hank or Bruce ever talked about the moment when Apache final cut was decided upon ..i often wonder how they felt about that iconic mutted run we know as the gallop...was this part of the original script from Jerry Lordan or Hanks jammi'n genious .... Wonder if Hank remembers when he decided thats it we'' do it at that.

If you mean the eight-bar B theme (chord of F major, melody notes C on the A string and F on the D string), it's part of the composition. Bert Weedon played it in a very similar way on his (slightly earlier) recording of Apache.

You can hear the bit I mean at 0:51 and 1:34 on this Youtube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrEgYNOr-qc

Bert's version has a different arrangement - without the Shadows' mid-song chorus in a staccato rhythm - but lasts only a few seconds less than Hank and Co's because it is taken at a markedly more sedate tempo (not that the Shadows version is a rocker). The Shads, though, use the B theme three times, and it is on the third time that for the second set of four bars, Hank plays an unmuted triad of the F chord, all on the sixth string (as far as I can tell): F (1st fret) - A - C - F (thirteenth fret). This part may well be Hank's own invention. I'd probably put a quid on that.

It has also been said that Hank's intro and outro part was an on-the-spot invention. And to some extent, it was. But the same basic idea is certainly present on the Bert Weedon version, played an octave lower and with a more muted (in both senses) sense of feeling...

JN

Yes Jim the stark contrast there....Apache now as we know it likely Hank as ever looking for that freshness he always runs to ground even back then ...

Did hank improvise the intro to Apache himself or was it as Jerry Lordan wrote it, because The Ramrods used it on the fade out to Riders in The Sky in 1961 which I think could have been a breach of copyright. On the Beatles recording of All You Need is Love,a saxophone player used a bit of Glenn Miller`s In The Mood at the end and the music publishers wanted royalties for it

Over the decades, I have heard several recordings use the intro to The Shads' version of Apache as their own introduction.

One I recall was Duane Eddy's 1965 Colpic recording of Riders In The Sky. A different version of Riders In The Sky - by The Surfaris (or at least, by one of the several groups by that name - actually used the main theme to Apache (played on guitar) as its middle eight, with the main RITS theme played on a tenor saxophone.

JN

JimN wrote:Over the decades, I have heard several recordings use the intro to The Shads' version of Apache as their own introduction.

One I recall was Duane Eddy's 1965 Colpic recording of Riders In The Sky. A different version of Riders In The Sky - by The Surfaris (or at least, by one of the several groups by that name - actually used the main theme to Apache (played on guitar) as its middle eight, with the main RITS theme played on a tenor saxophone.

JN

A 1965 recording of "Riders In The Sky" by Duane Eddy on the Colpix label? That one's new to me, or is it an unreleased recording, which you have heard? As far as I know, Duane Eddy first released a version of "Riders In The Sky", billed as "(Ghost) Riders In The Sky", on his 1996 album "Ghostrider - Great Guitar Hits".

A version of "Apache/Ghost Riders" where it is the "Apache" intro is on Ian McCutcheon's Shadows Workout 12+.

I don't know if Duane Eddy did an "Apache" intro, but it was not on my CD of "Ghost Rider".

Gary

I was recently looking through both Shads and Ventures discographies on various websites, and it was interesting to see the number of tunes common to both- some recorded first by the Shads and covered by the Ventures and vice versa..and then there's Bert, Duane, and all the other guitar instrumental groups and solo players.

It just proves that a damn good guitar tune is worth playing by anyone- and artists have often included certain sounds, intros, outros, effects or melody or bridge lines from other versions as a sort of compliment or acknowledgement of the appropriateness of what might be a classic recognisable part.

I like most versions myself, it's all good guitar music- let's hope it has a huge popular revival one day- then all us old geezers can get some gigs before we drop off our twigs!

Just to be different, in 1966 I used the intro to Screaming Lord Sutch's "Don't You Just Know it" to start Apache simply because it was very flash, and various squirts would come up to me and say "how do you play that"! I also used the intro to Nero's Trek to Rome on "Dust My Blues" - another flash run. I could never do the fast solos in Hall of the Mountain King though - still trying all these years later!