That Sound... again!!!

[noelford]

I've just returned from doing a freebie gig at a care home. It was very informal and cosy, with my audience sitting within a few feet of me. Volume had to be low and, as a consequence, tone was rubbish. But we all had a great time!

I agree that good tone is important, and though I am not one of those for whom 'That Sound' is the Holy Grail, I believe my normal tone isn't that far off (Justin Daish was very complimentary about it at the recent Get-Together in Northwich!) So, whilst chasing the perfect tone and perfect echo is fine, if that's what you want, let's not become so focussed on that, that we forget what is most important – the music, the playing and the enjoyment.

[JimN]

I agree, Noel. I get frequent opportunities to play a restricted range of Shads tunes at local jam nights*.

I usually use either a Jazzmaster or Jagmaster (each loaded with P90 replacement pickups), a SLTS-loaded Magicstomp and either a Hiwatt 100w solid state combo or a Fender Deluxe 112 (also solid-state) and always manage to get a sound that I find satisfactory.

Half the battle is getting the rest of the band to play with authority and confidence - as well as the right chords, of course!

JN

[* I've actually mnaged to convert some quite "rawky" players into fans of playing Shads material: The Stranger, Kon-Tiki, The Savage, Apache, Man Of Mystery, Sleepwalk, Flingel Bunt and a few others. I ought to add that I don't own the amps listed above.]

[neil2726]

I guess that at a normal (non Shads enthusiasts) gig, you could use any amp, any guitar with a tremelo, use the same echo setting for each instrumental - and no one would know the difference! Its the tune they remember - not the sound!

[roger bayliss]

I think the key is to find a sound that you are happy with that sounds reasonably near to the Shadows recording and most punters will be quite happy with that anyway and so should the performer. Sometimes where you stand and the room can make a big difference to what you want so need to spend 10 mins finding the right settings and positions for amps and PA and for standing to please your own ears. Very few if any of us sound like the records you know

[abstamaria]

I read that the Beatles gave up performing live, because they were beginning to lose control of their sound and not enjoying the music anymore. They said sometimes they coudn't even hear each other on stage, what with the size of the venues, the screaming fans, and the volume at which they played. They preferred and returned to the recording studio, where they could focus on the details and nuances of their music, the arrangement, and their sound.

I can relate to that. It would be inappropriate for me to call myself a "musician"; whoever parcels out talent and the ear for music must have been in short supply when I was born. I am more of a technician and try painstakingly to reproduce the music that haunted me so when I was very young. I now know though that is best done (and can probably only be done) in the studio, where I don't have to deal with mic'ed amplifiers or the effect of bodies on the mix as the place fills up. That is why I bother to switch amps, guitars, etc., even if it's "just practice" in the studio; I won't be able to appreciate the differences elsewhere. Trying to get that sound in a bar or theater is quite frustrating for me, especially since I have to rely on someone else to tell me how we sound to the audience. By the way, when I say "studio," I mean my garage.

Many of you are so talented. I am amazed and blown away by the phrasing, sensitivity, and expression displayed so nonchalantly in the sound files and YouTube clips posted here. I am inspired by all that and am encouraged (and reminded by the discussion on this thread) to concentrate on the music, the timing, the expression ... I may get there someday!

My best,

Andres

[Squier Ken]

And I hope you are all suitably impressed - as I am - that Noel spent his 40th wedding anniversary playing "a freebie gig at a care home"!

Congratulations to you & Margaret, Noel.

Ken

[stephen]

Noel, I wholeheartedly concur with your thoughts on this.Being relatively new both to trying to play Shadows tunes and this site, I've always been struck by the apparent over-emphasis that is given to achieving 'That Sound', perhaps at the expense of actually just enjoying playing the music.

Initially, I just sorted out what I thought was a reasonable, generic 'Shadows' echo sound on my Johnson and Valvetronix modelling combos and was quite happy to practice the tunes like that. Subsequently, I learned of Charlie Hall's EFTP patches and bought a Zoom G2 with them installed. That was really the revelation for me! I then realised just how far off the mark my pre-EFTP efforts had been!

Since that time, I've upgraded to an EFTP equipped Zoom G7.1ut and only being a home player, I just plug in a decent set of 'phones and I'm more than happy with the sound. In fact, I rarely play through an amp. these days, so don't have to juggle with effects/amp./volume settings. The only thing that needs to improve is my effectiveness & fluidity in playing the music. Sadly, a Custom Shop guitar/Meazzi/early AC15 with an EF86 circuit (!) isn't going to remove that responsibility from my fingers. If only it were that simple...............

However, I do appreciate that a gigging guitarist playing to an audience of Shadows fans, may well need to pay a lot more attention to achieving 'That Sound' than (thankfully!) I have to.
Stephen.

[noelford]

And I hope you are all suitably impressed - as I am - that Noel spent his 40th wedding anniversary playing "a freebie gig at a care home"!

Congratulations to you & Margaret, Noel.

Ken

Cheers, Ken! I think the fact that Margaret didn't mind me taking the time-out to play guitar on that day says a lot about why we're still together after 40 years!

[dave robinson]

Something that I have picked up on is, that a good player with the 'right feel' will always make average sounding kit seem almost right, where on the other hand, someone with the right sound but the lack of 'feel' can be most unconvincing - it's from the heart and in the fingers, at the risk of sounding like a broken record, practice, practice and more practice. Continually talking about the sound doesn't improve the actual playing or performance, practice does.

[abstamaria]

Something that I have picked up on is, that a good player with the 'right feel' will always make average sounding kit seem almost right, where on the other hand, someone with the right sound but the lack of 'feel' can be most unconvincing - it's from the heart and in the fingers, at the risk of sounding like a broken record, practice, practice and more practice. Continually talking about the sound doesn't improve the actual playing or performance, practice does.

That is very true. I have been put in my place many times by a good player sounding so differently on more basic equipment than mine. I think that is in-born talent; one has it or doesn't. With practice, an untalented player will improve dramatically, but there will be a ceiling. That isn't fair, but it's true. One sees that in many other fields - dance, theater, writing ...

I'm probably good at other things, but with music, the guitar, I know I will have to practice and work harder than most and accept that sometimes that will not be enough. But one tries.


Andy