Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

The Shadows, their music, their members and Shadows-related activity by former members of this community

Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Didier » 08 Jan 2010, 19:46

stratmantd wrote:I can accept that the MW&F material may not be to your linking Didier; personally I think it was some of the most original, thought-provoking music that Hank and Bruce have been involved with, and what a magnificent 3rd string to their bow with John Farrar.

I agree that's it's very good quality music, but I fail to see what's original or provoking about it. I have a DTS 4.0 coded version of the "Second Opinion" album (remastered from the quadraphonic version), but I just don't enjoy listening to it...
I never liked Crosby Stills Nash & Young, I didn't like either Marvin Welch & Farrar.

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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby ecca » 08 Jan 2010, 20:16

The 2 MWF offerings must rank amongst my all time faves.
They are played to death.
Love em.
Ecca
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Simon Underwood » 08 Jan 2010, 21:09

The first time I saw the Shads live was in 1974 at the Fairfield Halls in Croydon on one of their Eurovision 'warm up' gigs, and pretty much the first time I'd heard any MWF material, which blew me away almost as much as hearing 'Wonderful Land' for the first time a couple of years previously. It's a real shame they didn't have more success. I don't think we'll ever see them perform together again, but if they did, I'd be one of the first ones in the queue!

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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Fenderman » 08 Jan 2010, 22:27

I think the MWF period produced some superb albums, although they didn't sell well. I read somewhere that they played the Batley Variety Club as MWF and they walked off to 'the sound of their own footsteps!'. It seems that no one could not accept they were not the Shadows, they couldn't escape it. When Bruce left they made a 'Marvin & Farrar' album which was i think, a very dark album that didn't sell well. Then the Shads reformed at the end of '73 but they did include a few MWF tracks in their set but people still wanted to hear the old hits.
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby stratmantd » 08 Jan 2010, 22:34

I totally respect your position Didier; we all have our own tastes in music and should accept that they may differ.

At the time of MW&F some friends of mine thought that Yes were the greatest thing since sliced bread; I thought that they were pretentious and not worth a second listen.

I also think that Stairway To Heaven is the most over-hyped song of all time and I can count the number of Eric Clapton's tracks that I like on the fingers of one hand. It is all a matter of taste and no-one has the right to tell you what to like.

I can still remember almost being made to feel ashamed buying Shadows albums in record shops; the staff seemed to think that you had to like the music that they liked.

There used to be a shop in Edinburgh called Bruce's which had a really good classical section but unless you were "old" (probably over 35 to the staff) you were given strange looks if you went near it. Thankfully, I am now old enough to not care what a shop assistant thinks, in fact I am more likely now to let them know what I think about them if I get bad service.

Personally, I would love to hear the DTS version of Second Opinion as would many others on this site. Please keep your copy as you may find that your children/grandchildren may care to give it a listen and enjoy it.

chacun à son goût and quite right too.
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Fenderman » 08 Jan 2010, 22:50

I was practically laughed at for buying 'Dance with the Shadows' in HMV about 10 years ago. I should have complained but didn't have the time/inclination.
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby flingelbunt » 09 Jan 2010, 00:22

It's a fact that musical snobbery abounded regarding MWF. I well remember going on to 'The Diskery', a specialist record shop in Birmingham, for the first MWF album. I asked the guy at the counter if he could play a sample track, which he grudgingly did over the very loud shop hi-fi. Immediately, many other browsers in the shop stopped what they were doing and pricked their ears up at the tremendous sound resonating around the shop. Several people asked what the record was, only to shuffle off embarassed when they discovered it was 'that group'!! I have always claimed this was the most underrated output from the band- play a song like 'Tiny Robin' around Xmas and it evokes that very feeling of the season- 'Lady of the Morning'- what a fantastic number! My wife, who loves Heavy Rock had never encountered MWF until we met- she thinks it's tremendous stuff and deserves listening to- nuff said!!

Maurice ;)
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby damart » 09 Jan 2010, 01:49

Some of the MW&F songs were excellent. Faithful,Lady of the Morning,Tiny Robin, Thank Heavens I've got you to name a few were superb in my opinion. When The Shadows reformed in 1973 with John Farrar and Alan Tarney they produced some great music Rockin' with Curly Leads, Specs Appeal and their best live album by far at the Paris Olympia. I wish that line up could have stayed together as we probably would have a good variation of original vocal and instrumental tracks.
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Bojan » 09 Jan 2010, 02:52

I think that we can agree that the Shadows were the greatest instrumental group of all time. They are legendary; their haunting sound still brings chills when you listen to it. They were for instrumental music what the Beatles were for vocal group music. They have achieved greatness. Period. That is why this forum and others are devoted to them. I have absolutely nothing against MWF, but the fact is, I never heard of them until recently. First of all, I don't live in the UK and I had very little opportunity to listen to them. By the time they started performing, there were many, many similar groups, many of them far more popular and probably more interesting. MWF were no longer leaders, pioneers of music, they were followers of a trend created in the wake of the Beatles and the "British Invasion." So, they can never be compared to the early Shadows, even though individually, I'm sure that both Hank and Bruce had become more accomplished guitarists and vocalists, and John Farrar was a high quality artist and very talented musician in his own right, not to mention prolific songwriter. But they simply cannot compare to the fame and glory of the Shadows. Remember, I am speaking from the point of view of a foreigner. It turns out that the highlight of their career, at least as far as I am concerned, was the Eurovision song contest. People living in the UK probably see things differently. But let's not forget, the early Shadows had an unsurpassed energy and originality that later even they themselves lost. Listening to later Shadows is just not as exhilarating and thrilling as listening to the early Shadows. That is the same with MWF.

In a way, it's like Hank today. If he held a concert in which he played Django Reinhard music with his gypsy jazz band, I'm sure that many people would attend the concert, but there's no chance that he would keep filling huge concert halls day after day. Hank Marvin is a legend, but he is not a gypsy jazz legend. There are many guitarists that are much better in that particular music genre than he is, and I would have very little interest in listening to Hank play gypsy jazz (except for the fact the he is Hank! :o ). But for the early Shadows instrumentals Hank is what Django is for gypsy jazz. A legend, a guitar god, and an inspiration to hundreds and thousands, many of them famous guitarists. As part of MWF, I am simply not sure that he inspired anyone ... that is the difference.

This is just my opinion. I don't mean to ruffle any feathers or demean anything or anyone, and I don't wish to hurt anyone's feelings.

Cheers,
Bojan
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Re: Thoughts about Marvin, Welch & Farrar

Postby Bill Bowley » 09 Jan 2010, 04:53

I for one thought the 'Specs Appeal' LP was a good mix of MWF vocal and Shadows instrumental offerings, 'a good compromise' for want of a better phrase. I must admit that I was saddened by the departure of the two Australians from the mix (John Farrar and Alan Tarney) who of course are both master musicians in their own right and went on to produce hits for ONJ and Cliff respectively.

Still, 'the dogs bark, and the caravan moves on...............' :(
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