Have The Ventures out sold The Shadows ?

[Derek Mowbray]

I have been looking at a few of The Ventures many videos on You Tube.When they were inducted into The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame they were described as the number one instrumental group of all time selling over one hundred million albums and cd`s.
Can anyone verify this,does anyone have any sales figures for The Shadows record sales?. The Shadows have had world wide popularity except for America ,The Ventures were popular in Japan but so were The Shadows. The Ventures seemed to have been playing all the time for fifty years albeit with different line ups.I have noticed that over the years they have featured four different lead guitarists, the late Bob Bogle,Nokie Edwards,Gerry Mc Gee and Bob Spalding, they also all play bass guitar as well.So who are the number one instrumental group of all time is it a matter of record sales or world wide popularity or a matter of opinion.

[kittycph]

When it comes to who is "best" in a US based list, they never count groups or artists that hasn't been popular in USA.
Doesn't matter if an artist or a group is loved by 1 billion people all over the world. They have to be a "name" over there to be counted in.
We have seen it before.

[AlanMcKillop]

Have The Ventures out sold The Shadows ?
Yes, by a mile.

[alewis41]

We went down this path a little while ago...

http://shadowmusic.bdme.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2674

[dave robinson]

I agree with Ecca, though his post has been removed - what he said in effect was, is it really relevant?

Clearly it is obvious that The Ventures outsold The Shadows record wise, because they probably made more recordings and because they are more widely known.
We all know that the massive record buying public of the USA are largely unaware of our heroes, possibly down to poor marketing back in the 60's, but that's water under the bridge.

What is clear to me is the difference in quality of the two bands. I have seldom heard The Ventures guitars actually in tune with each other and I find the majority of their stuff offends my ears. I have never been impressed with their drums either - sound or playing.
On the contrary I find that The Shads are easy to listen to and are a different class , Tony Meehan and Brian Bennett being the governors on this kind of music, though I don't like everything that they have recorded. So for me it's quality over quantity every time.

[cockroach]

Objectively, based on evidence, the Ventures would probably have sold significantly more recordings than the Shadows- and remember that both groups first achieved significant chart successes in 1960. Apache and Walk Don't Run both charted in many countries.

The Ventures have also kept working, recording and releasing new material and touring consistently and regularly, keeping themselves visible to the existing faithful fans, and also new fans, from 1960 to now- unlike the Shads, who have stopped and started on and off between the first breakup in 1968 and the 2009 Cliff/Shads tour.

The Ventures also 'got in first' in their home country the USA, and also got very popular in Japan. Both are large markets. Remember that before the Beatles and the so called 'British Invasion', it was damn nigh impossible for anyone who was not American to achieve significant and continuing success in America- particularly if they did not tour and promote themselves long and hard over there.

Subjectively, I presume people either prefer the Shads or the Ventures, or they like both.

People then 'vote with their wallets' when they then choose and buy the product.

The quality versus quantity argument is subjective in my opinion.

Eminem, for example sold or sells recordings in the millions, and has probably made truckloads of money- probably more than the Shads and Ventures put together.

I can't stand rap myself- don't even consider it to be music as such- but what would Mr. Marshall Mathers care about my opinion?

Obviously, based on their past and continuing success, and audiences who still buy concert tickets, recordings and merchandise etc, the Ventures are still a viable commercial entertainment unit- regardless of change of personnel, or even their poor guitar tuning skills! (Yes Dave Robinson, we KNOW you hate them!!)

They probably have a long standing joint agreement or understanding within the band that they will keep going as long as there is public demand.

The Shadows perhaps don't operate like that - maybe they are willing to get together every now and then, but do not want to be committed to a permanent touring and recording band.

Maybe because of that they have been far more choosy about what, how and when, and to whom they play- that is their choice.

[David Martin]

Outsold but not outplayed...

[ecca]

I bought a 'Best of' Ventures' CD not long back and I found it disappointing.
I loved loved loved Walk Don't Run and Perfidia when they first came out but there's no variety.
Everything sounds the same, no subtlety.


I'd put Al Bakwell's tin hat on but it'll bury me.

[Pedro]

I think The Ventures rhythm guitarist is up to much.

[damart]

The Shadows were much bigger in the UK than the Ventures were in the USA. You've only got to look at the billboard charts. Ventures still tour Japan where their biggest market is. DPM