tony meehan with bert weedon

[moondawg61]

on a bert weedon site,tony meehan is listed
as playing drums on bert weedon's song'red guitar'
does any member have more info. on the year and if
tony played on any other tracks with bert.
thank you,
moondawg61

[JimN]

Just after Tony had left The Shadows (in October 1961), he had a short association with Bert Weedon via the Associated-Rediffusion children’s’ TV magazine programme “Lucky Dip” (later to morph into “Tuesday Rendezvous” and “Five-o-Clock Club”). I suppose it was also the precursor to Thames TV’s “Magpie”. Bert was a resident presenter and performer on “Lucky Dip“, and at the time, for anyone (especially anyone still at school) interested in the electric guitar, the programme was just about the only one where you could guarantee to see a guitar being played live every week.

One autumn day, Bert announced that he was going to do a series of weekly items on playing in a group (at the time, outside the confines of a few places such as the Cavern Club in Liverpool or The Crawdaddy in Richmond, this meant a group like Cliff and The Shads). He said that the following week, he’d have one of The Shadows in the studio.

Things were moving fast in the world of The Shadows, and when the following programme came (transmitted live), Bert asked Tony about his relationship with the group. Tony diplomatically answered with a phrase probably being used for the very first time. He said he was “one of the original Shadows”.

He went on to do a question and answer session about drums, illustrating his replies with his Gretsch kit. He advised that anyone wanting to take up drums, but who had to buy one item at a time, should buy the snare first, then a hi-hat, then a bass drum, and so on.

As the next few weeks went by, other musicians (mainly session-player mates of Bert) came in and the “group” expanded. There is a TV studio photo on the web somewhere of Bert (with a sunburst Hofner Verithin) and Tony sitting at his kit, with a (double) bassist also present. I assume that Red Guitar was recorded at about this time.

Soon after, Tony began his association as a staff member with Decca Records and early in 1962 (only a very few months later), he had the deputed job of meeting Brian Epstein at Decca’s offices and telling him that Decca weren’t going to sign The Beatles following their famous 1st January 1962 recorded audition…

[moondawg61]

excellent info. jim,
thank you,as you added a lot of intresting feedback on
the bert weedon and tony meehan 'red guitar' song
and how it came about
all the best,
moondawg61

[russ]

I think I am right in saying "Red Guitar" was the B side to "China Doll" which also featured Tony on drums

[JimN]

I think I am right in saying "Red Guitar" was the B side to "China Doll" which also featured Tony on drums

Interesting. China Doll was introduced as the theme tune to the "Lucky Dip" programme just as it changed its name to "Tuesday Rendezvous". Bert had written the tune and let viewers vote for a title, meaning that this must have been a little time before the release of the record version (because it definitely says China Doll on the label). Considering how late in 1961 this was, it may be that Tony's unexpected availability gave rise to the recording line-up and to the premise of the several-week series of articles on playing in a group.

JN

[Derek Mowbray]

I remember seeing one of those TV shows when Tony Meehan played drums in Bert`s backing group.In one number a drum stick flew out of Tony`s hand and you could see him pick it up. I was under the impression that Tony played on China Doll.

[Arpeggio]

As ever, always wonderful information about things that we'd long forgotten about - or never knew in the first place!! Fascinating. Thanks to the original poster and all of the replies (arise Sir James of Nugent once again!! Phew!!). Members of Shadow Music may not know that - between leaving the Shadows in early October, 1961 and starting work for Decca in January, 1962 - Tony had a spell freelancing for Joe Meek (mentioned in a recent thread) at 304, Holloway Road. Future Shadows Brian Bennett and Brian Locking also had brief spells there - backing singer Michael Cox along with Big Jim Sullivan. Thanks to the Tony Meehan / Big Jim Sullivan (who was often used a session player by Joe Meek) connections - Jet Harris also recorded a few tracks at 304 Holloway Road. Sadly, Tony is now deceased and Jet never could recall exactly what was recorded there (unreleased of course) in between quitting the Shadows on April 15th, 1962 and the release of "Besame Mucho". Given that Charles Blackwell (who produced Jet's Decca material) was also involved (& he also did a lot of work for Joe Meek) - I do wonder if the idea of a version of "Besame Mucho" originated there. There is a very strange, haunting and powerful demo - like quasi - backing track for "Besame Mucho" (multi - tracked pianos - sounds ordinary I know - but it's very doomy and almost threatening) which remained unreleased until 2007. It's credited to one Dave Rowland - but no - one has any idea who he is /was. However, reading the tracklisting credits once again - I note that the melody was supposedly arranged by Outlaws' guitarist Billy Kuy. Hmmmm.....as a theory...I reckon it fits reasonably well.

Rob

[anniv 63]

It is also possible that Jet Harris visited Joe Meek's studio after his Decca contract
expired in early 1964.
Whether or not anything was commited to tape or demo is debatable as Joe's sessions
are reported as sometimes being erratic and vague at times especially in later years.
As previously mentioned, Jet himself couldn't recall details.

Mike

[Arpeggio]

Thanks for that Mike. When Joe Meek died in February 1967 his studio had to be cleared out pretty quickly. Just over 3,000 master tape reels were literally crammed into boxes and tea chests (hence they famously became known as 'The Tea Chest Tapes'). Almost 1,900 reels were legitimately acquired by impresario George Cooper's son Cliff - himself a former member of RGM group the millionaires. Ironic really - as Cliff Cooper is nowadays a multi - millionaire. He has done nothing with the tapes for 45 years. The only person to have heard them all was RGM expert Alan Blackburn (& that was nearly 30 years ago now). Basically - Joe virtually never wrote anything on the tape reels or boxes & what he did (rarely) write was usually in code. There were many hundreds of un - named tracks whre where the artist's identity remained a mystery - even more of a problem for instrumentals. 30 years on, Alan can't be sure if he heard any Jet Harris material. Sadly -the other scenario is that any material recorded by Jet may have been in the 1,200 or so tapes taken away by Joe's older brothers. They were countrymen and farmers who had little interest in, nor knew anything about music. Virtually all of those tapes removed by the Meek family were stored in derelict barns, sheds and outhouses. it has been confirmed that, by the time those particular tapes were looked at in the mid 1980s, they literally crumbled to dust at the touch. All were dumped on a council waste disposal site. All that survived were c. 30 or so reels which had, largely by accident, been stored indoors (+ a few acetates which were still playable). What was on those 1,200 or so tapes we will never know. I should also mention that John Rostill also recorded for Joe Meek - initially with singer Terry Young and then with the group (including guitarist Bruce Baxter and future Roy Orbison MD Barry Booth) in their own right. Joe Meek was so taken with John that he considered him as Heinz's replacement in the Tornados - but John was then offered the job with the Shadows almost immediately afterwards.

Bests.....Rob

[russ]

What fascinating stories!
Such a shame we don't have a music scene like this nowadays.
What a pity about those lost Joe Meek recordings, but I can understand that Joe's brothers didn't understand the value of what they had.
I watched the "Arena" programme on his life a few years back.
Also featured in that show was also another weird genius Geoff Goddard.
What a great songwriter.
Thanks again Jim for such great memories, and always a joy to read your posts Rob.
I have followed you since your "See For Miles" days Rob, and bought a copy of your book "Funny Old World" must be getting on for 20 years ago.
Thats another thing I miss about this world of mp3's , no sleeve notes!

Best Regards

Russ