Orchestration, Wonderful Land & Atlantis

[LazerBass]

Hi,
I did a quick search for "Orchestration" and got a few results off the Forum.
When I was a Nipper back in the 60's, I always disliked the way many Pop-songs started out with the Band playing and then in came London Phil+Harmonica and took over from the Guitars etc. This went on even into the 70's.
This was very disappointing (to me at least) on W/Land & Atlantis, particularly the latter with all those sappy Choral Harmonies chucked in as well. The Bass-line is all but annihilated.
I've often wondered if the Shadows where playing a special Gig when Atlantis was recorded and just which Producer thought that Strings + Choir was a good idea and decided to do it?
My latest Shadows CD "50 Golden Greats" has a version of W/Land with no Orchestration. What an improvement. Just the Shadows, doing the biz!
Atlantis - is unfortunately the same as ever, but again, I wonder if any members know if there is a Studio version with no Strings attached and the Ladies Choir were kept locked-up in the Lav'?
Cheers, Lazers

[JimN]

My latest Shadows CD "50 Golden Greats" has a version of W/Land with no Orchestration. What an improvement. Just the Shadows, doing the biz!
Atlantis - is unfortunately the same as ever, but again, I wonder if any members know if there is a Studio version with no Strings attached and the Ladies Choir were kept locked-up in the Lav'?
Cheers, Lazers

There is, and it was issued on the same CD as that on which the undubbed version of Wonderful Land was first released.

"The Shadows At Abbey Road"; EMI (UK) 1997; 8 23042 2 (stereo)

[Moderne]

Although I'm sure there are exceptions to this, in general The Shadows were in favour of some of their recordings being augmented by strings, horns, voices etc. Indeed Hank has many times relayed how Norrie Paramor (the name of the producer you requested) had dubbed strings and French horns onto their basic recording of Wonderful Land and transformed it into an a 'wonderful'-sounding record which spent eight weeks at no.1. By and large I feel the orchestrations were tasteful and enhanced the original recording and I've not listened to the un-dubbed versions (on 'The Shadows at Abbey Road' CD which Jim mentioned) more than a couple of times. I agree that a lot of records from this period (Hallelujah I Love Her So by Eddie Cochran springs to mind, and some Ray Charles songs of the time) are spoilt by the OTT string (+ choir) arrangements but in the case of The Shadows, they were nearly always 'a good thing' - indeed in the case of tunes such as The Breeze and I and Return to the Alamo (Norrie's last string arrangement for The Shads in 1977) the records would have been incomplete and vastly inferior without their orchestral backings.

[Stratpicker]

I seem to remember reading that Wonderful Land was recorded quite some time before release. They thought it was a good tune but the recording was nothing special or was lacking something so it got held. Later on, whilst The Shad were out on Tour, or similar, Norrie Paramour revisited it and added the strings and - BIngo! a huge Hit and a Classic Shads tune!
Anyone add more to this?
Ian

[Paul Childs]

Wasn't there an extra bass drum added to Wonderful Land as well which was removed again in recent times for CDs?

[Gary Allen]

According to Wikipedia, ,wonderful land spent 8 weeks at no.1, remaining there longer than any other single in the entire 60s, it's a magestic melody and I think paramor's addition brings the listener to another place,making it a timeless classic and probably most fans favourite shads tune, regards from a cold and wet Dublin, Gary

[cockroach]

Well, it was a trend by record producers in the late '50's/early '60's to put strings/orchestra, choral backing etc on pop records...sort of trying to make pop 'respectable' after all the wild initial wave of rock music..

There were very successful things by Buddy Holly, The Drifters (the American vocal group) and also Duane Eddy (Because They're Young)which were augmented by orchestrated backings- not to mention most of Adam Faith's material with the John Barry Orchestra etc

Back then as a teenage rock and guitar fan, it was bloody awful and corny to me! Sounded like old peoples' music, and spoiled our beloved music!

But in hindsight, much of it was tastefully done and often enhanced the records...

Apart from backing tracks, you might need to find a friendly keyboard/synth player to do the orchestral stuff for you...I was a member of a small Shads club a few years ago- and a keyboard player used to join us at most get togethers- he could do all that stuff when we played Wonderful Land etc!

[noelford]

Well, I have to admit to adding srings and synth to the basic Apache BT!

[tolo]

For myself - it was exactly this, the marriage of beautiful orchestration and the melody and tone from Hanks guitar that got me hooked. There is a certain 'majesty' to those Paramor recordings that was never really replicated down the line. The Miracle got close though - and I love the string arrangement in 'Goodnight Dick' - very John Barry! Also, it was always one of the things that disappointed me in live performances - the strings then were always a little too synthetic (although those synth strings were a definitive sound of the 80's I suppose - along with those early simmonds drum sounds)

For me 'Wonderful Land' just isn't the same without those Strings and French Horn arrangements.

[LazerBass]

Hi,
Thanks for all your replies. It has been good to read and learn from other people's opinions, about a subject that has always vexed me a bit.
I read about Norrie Paramor and all the musicians/singers he had worked with down the thru the years.
I recall in the 60's, the Shadows being voted the one Band that appealed to most age-groups, who had varying musical tastes?

I've just got back from my local Shadows Music Club session in York (first visit) but I noticed that no one played "Atlantis".
When I first heard "W/Land" without Strings - I immediately thought (as a Bassist would) "Great-stuff, there's a bit more room for me".
For no strings "Atlantis", I can't wait to buy a copy of "The Shadows at Abbey Road" - thanks Jim.
Regards, Paul