When did Hank stop playing his Burns

[cockroach]

I thought around that time was when Fender did start to get some quality issues. That also seemed to be the the time of copies starting to appear. I know I had a couple of horror models around that time.
I believe the Strat that Hank purchased included a Humbucker which he wasn't keen on ?

There had been a couple of low quality "copies" of the Strat by 1972, but they were pretty half-hearted, often with mahogany necks and usually with bridge/tailpiece arrangements which bore little resemblance to the real thing. And don't even ask about the tuners...

The first thoroughgoing copies made their UK appearance in around late 1974 or early 1975, but even they (under the name "Grant") were only so-so (at around £50). The first quality copy of the Strat I ever saw was an Aria re-make of an early model (small headstock, maple fretboard) in late 1976. It also had an anodised pickguard and a stripped back finish. It was trying to look well-used and "vintage".

After that, there were a few others, but they usually managed to look different enough in one feature or another that they were not in danger of trademark infringement. They usually featured a hard tail of some sort.

It all changed in 1981, when the first batch of Tokai guitars arrived in the UK. Then, from the summer of 1982 onward, it changed forever with the introduction to Europe of the Squier brand.

Here in Oz, top quality Ibanez copies (pretty exact copies too!) came in around 1973...their Gibson and Fender copies were superb and a fraction of Fender and Gibson prices. I was playing bass for a few years then and had new Ibanez Gibson EB3 and Fender Precision copies- only thing different was the name on the headstock!

As you say, Aria made good copies too- and there were others branded Suzuki which were excellent- although back then, few Japanese guitars had the reputations for quality which people eventually realised later..good quality original design Yamahas were also available from the late '60's too..

[Uncle Fiesta]

I have a photo, taken in about 1978, of a friend playing a Kimbara. It's more or less a copy of a Strat of the period - large CBS-style headstock, maple neck, natural finish and white plastic parts.

Someone at the Shadows Club I attend has the exact same guitar ... and it's brilliant!

[cockroach]

Yes indeed..

Hank could have saved himself a few bob and bought a Japanese copy back then....although he could probably afford a Fender by then...

He certainly didn't seek out a vintage model, as the one he bought was a pretty much standard newish/recent Strat...which he then proceeded to customise with different pickups etc..

[negninegaw]

So someone here knows the guy that 'owns' the stolen 12 string.
Did he try and persuade him to give it back?
What was the name of the band he played in?

[Fenderman]

It was mentioned that their management was contacted but they weren't interested.
I bet Hank would take it back in a heartbeat if he could though!

[JimN]

So someone here knows the guy that 'owns' the stolen 12 string.

The story mentioned Hank's greenburst Marvin (the one used in Finders Keepers), not a 12-string. Hank still has his Burns 12 strings from th sixties as far as any of us can know. He certainly had them in 1986.

I have heard two quite separate stories about the Gibson acoustics (including a B-45 12 string used on My Grandfather's Clock, the acoustic Genie, Chelsea Boot, etc).

One (from an impeccable source) was that they were damaged in air transit (luggage handlers!). That would probably be late 1969 at least, since Hank used one of the J-45s for the UK and Japanese tours that autumn (think Slaughter On 10th Avenue and Puttin' On The Style).

The other is that they were stolen from that van in 1972.

It's possible that some were lost in one incident and the rest in the other one.

[Iain Purdon]

I would imagine Marmaduke was the last song recorded with a Burns Marvin.

Who knows! I've just listened to Marmaduke again and, with three different guitarists, I can't tell for sure which parts are played by whom, let alone what guitars are being used. There's nothing "Shadowy" about the sound at all!

Now there's an interesting thought...wonder how Rockin with Curly Leads would have turned out, if Hank had still had the Burns....

I honestly don't think it would have made any difference. John introduced loads of new guitar (and other) sounds to that album and Hank had branched out a lot too. I suspect Hank could have used either Fender or Burns (or any other guitar) on Rocking with Curly Leads and nobody would have known for sure what it was.

[JimN]

Now there's an interesting thought...wonder how Rockin with Curly Leads would have turned out, if Hank had still had the Burns....

I honestly don't think it would have made any difference. John introduced loads of new guitar (and other) sounds to that album and Hank had branched out a lot too. I suspect Hank could have used either Fender or Burns (or any other guitar) on Rocking with Curly Leads and nobody would have known for sure what it was.

It wasn't either of the Burns guitars. They were long gone.

A Melody Maker or NME article from the autumn of 1973 mentioned that Hank was using a "white Stratocaster" in the studio. That could have been 34346 or the Barratt's Strat.

[StuartD]

HI Jim

It was the Barrett's Strat when i went. It's that guitar on Years Away.

In John Rostill's last appearances with them, at Sheffield Fiesta in June 1971, they used the 6 and 12 string Gibson acoustics. On Slaughgter, Hank used his Ramirez Classic guitar

Regards

Stu

[JimN]

HI Jim

It was the Barrett's Strat when i went. It's that guitar on Years Away.

Yes - that ties up with contemporary journalism - obviously, "white" was close enough to "blond".

In John Rostill's last appearances with them, at Sheffield Fiesta in June 1971, they used the 6 and 12 string Gibson acoustics. On Slaughter, Hank used his Ramirez Classic guitar
Regards
Stu

Do you mean that Hank played Slaughter On 10th Avenue as late as 1971 live on stage? Or simply that he used the Ramirez on the record? As we know, he played one of the cherry-sunburst J-45s for the 1969 tour when the Welch-less Shadows were promoting that (then-current) single.

That's interesting about the Sheffield Fiesta appearance - so they still had the Gibson acousticss as late as 1971 (overlapping with the Martins they obtained for MW&F purposes?

I didn't realise that John Rostill played with them as late as 1971. As far as I knew (which would only have been from newspapers, the musical press and odd TV appearances), John R hadn't done much with the Shadows (or MWF) since the end of 1969 - other than for doing whichever "Shades of Rock" tracks he played on.

Fascinating stuff...

We have to meet up some time...